Related, https://2awhiterook.com/thoughts-and-observations-from-the-woods-vol-4/
Sunday, I got out shooting. I was suffering from an extra severe case of burnt gun powder withdrawals. I went to the same place as last week, the bald hill, shooting down into the gully/depressions. I wasn’t about to waste all that time going to the usual spot, or trying to, only to find all the downed trees and having to cut. Plus I was alone, so all the more reason to not take chances.
I’ve got a Tikka T1X… Fantastic rifle, it’s a .22LR, I was using CCI Mini Mag 36gr CPHP’s. About 3″ (10) groups at 100 yards, which is larger than normal, 1 1/2″ is normal. They were a tad to the right, but the wind was left to right and gusting, which makes sense. The guy at the gun store told me I should try sub sonic ammo for long range, it’ll tighten the groups because the bullet doesn’t pass enter and exit the sound barrier, whatever, physics isn’t my thing. I intend to try sub sonics, and see if the guy was right. It’s an interesting idea. The only real gripe with this rifle is the magazines. They’re (10) shot, and non flush fit, and they have the flimsiest follower. I’ve wrecked three so far, if you load the cartridges, just a hair off center or slightly tilted, it somehow bends and ruins the follower and follower spring. The magazines are as expensive as a Glock OEM magazine, and I can only find them at the gun store, and only sometimes. No where online has them, that I’ve found. There’s been a couple times where I couldn’t take it shooting, because of a lack of a magazine, and the gun store didn’t have one in stock.
One thing too, not a single dud, from the CCI Mini Mag 36gr CPHP and I shout (120) rounds. It’s the best and most reliable .22LR ammo I’ve ever seen.
The DDM4V7 SLW, did as advertised, it worked. I didn’t shoot it too much, it’s a pencil barrel. And it was in the mid ’80s, to ’90 out, and I was atop a bald hill shooting down into a gully. The Winchester Lake City M855, isn’t “accurate”, but, certainly better than “minute of man”, and it’s never failed. I’ve been curious about what some 77gr ammo would do, it’s got a 1/7 twist, but, the cost… Plus, this is a tool, first and foremost. I believe in the “general purpose” idea. And from what I’ve seen, the M855, with it’s slight lack in accuracy, more than makes up for it, with penetration, when compared to M193 and other non steel core penetrator 62gr bullets. Plus the reliability factor, I’ve never had an ammo problem with Win. L.C. M855. Never. And I’ve shot tens of thousands, probably closing in on 100,000 rounds over the years of it. I can’t say the same about any other ammo in terms of reliability.
Now, the Weatherby Vanguard Outfitter in .223 Remington, this was most curious. It’s a “hunting” rifle, not a “target” rifle. The Vortex Diamondback 4-12x 40mm is very nice for spotting .22 caliber holes at 100 yards. A 3-9x just couldn’t do that. Now the wind did get gusty at times but for the most part, had settled down before I uncased the Weatherby. Before going, last week I bit the bullet, literally, and bought target ammo, not plinking ammo. Winchester 62gr FMJ “White Box” is trash. Weatherby’s spec sheet on their website is full of typos, but, mine has a 24″ barrel and looks like a 1/8 twist barrel.
I made notes, in my ‘Gun Book’. At 100yards, from a bench, first was Federal Premium Gold Medal Sierra Matchking 69gr. It was the best ammo of the day. (5) shot groups, were 1″ to 1 1/2″, the smallest was 1″ with four holes touching.
Then, Fed. Prem. Gold Medal Center Strike Open Tip Match 77gr… The Weatherby did not like it. I’m not surprised, given the twist. The smallest (5) group was 1 1/2″, the rest 3″. I’m not surprised, 77gr is getting heavy for a 1/8 twist barrel.
And here’s the curious part… Nosler. I made a note, in big and bold print in my ‘Gun Book’, “DO NOT USE”. This was Nosler Match Grade 77gr HPBT. The first (5) shot group, cycled and fired fine, though accuracy was about 1 3/4″. Then, after letting the barrel cool, I loaded (5) more, and closed the action, but couldn’t turn the bold handle down. It was tight. I didn’t force it. I ejected the cartridge, and not seeing any obvious issues, pulled another from the box, and tried chambering that. Couldn’t turn the bolt handle down AGAIN. I ended up cycling, or trying to all (15) cartridges and only (2) would the bolt handle close on without any resistance. I did not shoot those (2), I was too leery. None of the cartridges, to the naked eye, looked bad. Even the spent brass from the first (5) looked fine. Very strange given Nosler’s reputation.
When I was at the gun store buying this target ammo, the only 62gr ammo they had was either junk PMC, or Speer- I forget the name, but personal defense stuff. All the target ammo was 69gr and higher. Next time, I think I’ll try some of the Speer 62gr and see what it does. I’ll also get more of the Fed. Prem. Gold Medal Sierra Matchking 69gr.
Then the Glock 34 Gen. 5 MOS. Given how miserable most of the range ammo’s been, I did some more checking on the Winchester 9mm NATO, and found some interesting things.
The Fiocchi I shot last week which was terrible was 115gr FMJ and rated at 1200fps. This Win. 9mm NATO 124gr FMJ is rated at 1200fps. The Fiocchi 124gr FMJ I first used in this a month or two ago, is rated at 1150fps. Plain Winchester 124gr FMJ 9mm Luger is 1140fps and Federal American Eagle 124gr FMJ is 1150fps. But look at the numbers Harrell got, versus what the boxes said? Big difference. The range ammo I’ve been shooting, most of it’s felt soft enough to resemble low powered .38spl’s like wadcutters. And I checked the G34’s book again, and found a small bit I’d not noticed before, it said only use ammo which is in spec with SAAMI, CIP and NATO. But no mention of caliber or +P or the like.
If standard max 9mm Luger chamber pressure is 35,000psi and 9mm NATO pressure is 36,500psi, how does one account for the muzzle velocity difference, when what’s stated on the boxes of 9mm Luger don’t come close to what they’re chronographed out of a full sized service pistol? How can the 9mm NATO with supposedly such high pressure, be chronographed at about where the 9mm Luger is supposed to be in terms of muzzle velocity?
Well I ordered a case of Winchester 124gr FMJ 9mm NATO. A case of 1,000 came in 50ct boxes. The boxes say, in fine print, where they tell you not to shoot your foot off and don’t shoot your pal in the ass, “USE ONLY in modern 9mm firearms in good condition. These cartridges are loaded to military velocity and pressure; average pressure is 10% to 15% higher than industry standard pressure for 9mm Luger.“
I shot it, the whole case. It’s STRONGER alright. It took 100 to 200 rounds to get a grip on it, literally. I had to overcome the muscle memory of how to hold the G34 with the obviously under-loaded garbage I’d been shooting. Harrell said he couldn’t feel a difference. Well, in the 5 years since that video was put up the ammo companies must’ve really down loaded their cartridges since then. Once I got used to it, and having adjusted my grip, I had no issues with it, it no longer seemed STRONG. It was consistent, no issues at all, I even brought (10) new OD colored Glock OEM (17) round magazines, all fine.
Accuracy? Eh, I’m not sure. I could hit the plates, but I had some trouble at times, which I wonder if it had more to do with the very obvious increase in velocity affecting point of aim and point of impact? I was much better at snap shooting, starting from a low ready, and quickly raising the pistol up and firing, without aiming. Shooting the logs was very easy. But there again, I wasn’t really aiming. I think I need to work more on NOT aiming at paper plates and instead just shooting them, which I sometimes forgot to do. When I didn’t really aim at them, I hit. Also, I think I need to shoot it from a rest, and see about the sights, as the rear’s adjustable for both windage and elevation. I’m sure the 9mm NATO’s point of impact is different from the garbage I’ve been shooting.
Another thing, it’s smoky. Not as bad as Federal American Eagle 115gr FMJ, but still smoky. And it’s smelly. The powder smells different than the other stuff I’ve shot, and it’s potent.
The Triple K holster works. But that snap, it really does take two hands most times to break it. Even though it’s a thumb break holster. It works, but it’s not ideal. If I ever see another brand’s offering, I’ll be tempted to buy it.
And while I’ve read on some forums some are concerned about excess wear and tear on the guns from the 9mm NATO, I’m not. With the amount I shoot, I’m sure this G34 will have to be taken to a gunsmith in under a year anyway. And besides, from everything I’ve read and seen, this 9mm NATO looks like just standard 9mm Luger, while 9mm Luger is down loaded to the point where it’s as reliable as lousy .22LR ammo.
Next time out, I’m going to want to shoot it at somethings, and see what kind of damage it does or doesn’t do. Like a melon, or maybe some old junk, or a fresh log as opposed to the old and rotting logs I was shooting.
And there’s something else, I only saw one set of deer tracks. And no deer “berries”. People blame wolves, and yeah, they don’t help, but the real killer has been bad winters, too much in too short a time logging- the state forest has too much of the same aged timber, not the various ages a forest needs to remain healthy, and that the idiots in St. Paul keep handing out doe permits. Sure, deer are down, so lets go kill the breeders… Brilliant. Then there’s CWD, which the idiots in St. Paul now are worried about in all the surrounding counties, and though vague yet, it sounds like there’ll be mandatory CWD testing if not for all deer then at least the first weekend of firearms season. It doesn’t sound like any of that will apply to the county the state forest is in. Though I’m starting to have second thoughts about deer hunting and the potential of shooting a zombie buck. I’m tempted to only hunt grouse, as they never seem to get sick…
And now since the three readers of this blog (me, myself and I) don’t pay me to write all this, I’m calling it quits on this post.
Equip, train, pray and never disarm.
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